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Just curious. Why do you want to upgrade your braking system? I have had my 2014 3 since new. I am a retired race car driver and my OEM brakes do just fine. Now if you are tracking the car that is a different story but for street use I don't see a big improvement. Please explain.
 

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You’ll get worse performance then stock, to be honest with you.

Those rotors are designed for show > over actual performance.

From StopTech’s site:

“WHY CROSS-DRILLED/SLOTTED ROTORS?
Drilled and Slotted brake rotors are designed to increase braking performance and are a perfect choice for vehicles with great looking wheels.

While we do not recommend drilled and slotted brake rotors for severe duty applications like racing, police, ambulance, or towing they do work excellent for street driven performance vehicles.”



LOL.

I can show you many other sites that sell regular blank rotors along side drilled and slotted one’s. Both drilled and slotted say: NOT FOR TRACK USE. While the regular blank rotors are good to go for track duty.

Drilled and slotted rotors remove precious metal from the rotor, leaving you with less MASS.

If you want true increased performance then you simply need to upgrade to a better brake pad that handles more heat and has more bite. The OEM blank rotor is best to handle all the heat you can throw at it and not CRACK under stress like a drilled rotor would. It’s all for show man. Don’t waste you money on that BS.
 

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Not to hijack this thread, but what to do about the 'warping' that some of us experience with the OEM rear rotors?

Replace with another set of OEM rotors or upgrade to a different solid rotor, and which one?
 

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You’ll get worse performance then stock, to be honest with you.

Those rotors are designed for show > over actual performance.

From StopTech’s site:

“WHY CROSS-DRILLED/SLOTTED ROTORS?
Drilled and Slotted brake rotors are designed to increase braking performance and are a perfect choice for vehicles with great looking wheels.

While we do not recommend drilled and slotted brake rotors for severe duty applications like racing, police, ambulance, or towing they do work excellent for street driven performance vehicles.”



LOL.

I can show you many other sites that sell regular blank rotors along side drilled and slotted one’s. Both drilled and slotted say: NOT FOR TRACK USE. While the regular blank rotors are good to go for track duty.

Drilled and slotted rotors remove precious metal from the rotor, leaving you with less MASS.

If you want true increased performance then you simply need to upgrade to a better brake pad that handles more heat and has more bite. The OEM blank rotor is best to handle all the heat you can throw at it and not CRACK under stress like a drilled rotor would. It’s all for show man. Don’t waste you money on that BS.
That thinking from 20 years ago is still being parroted across the internet today. Years ago drilled rotors were made by actually drilling sold rotors, which did create weaknesses in the castings that caused cracking between the holes. New technology has created new designs that are cast with the holes in place. These new rotors don't have the same propensity to crack, and in fact can perform better than solid rotors. They will heat faster, allowing you to use pads in a higher heat range, and will cool faster. I have a set of DBA drilled rotors on my MX-5. They work great and have done so for 3 years now with no issues.



Here is a pretty good discussion on this subject by some engineer types that actually tested and compared solid and drilled rotors-

https://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=580860&highlight=drilled+rotors

As to not good for the track, note post # 42 in that thread....

Not to hijack this thread, but what to do about the 'warping' that some of us experience with the OEM rear rotors?

Replace with another set of OEM rotors or upgrade to a different solid rotor, and which one?
They are throw aways, just replace them with something decent like Centric or StopTech.
 

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Here's my install of the Power stop middle range kit (lowest drilled/slotted rotor package). I find them at the very least as good as stock - my gut tells me they feel a bit better but the only comparison i have is from before repair, where i was having pulsing feeling from the pedal likely from warped rotor, to after the install - so of course it was much better - it would have been better with new stock parts too. I've not tested any fading scenario yet.

https://mazda3revolution.com/forums/2014-2018-mazda-3-skyactiv-suspension-handling/233743-2016-power-stop-z23-rotor-pad-install.html#post2442269
 

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Copy N Paste from a stoptech article.

Myth # 1 – BRAKE JUDDER AND VIBRATION IS CAUSED BY DISCS THAT HAVE BEEN WARPED FROM EXESSIVE HEAT.
The term "warped brake disc" has been in common use in motor racing for decades. When a driver reports a vibration under hard braking, inexperienced crews, after checking for (and not finding) cracks often attribute the vibration to "warped discs". They then measure the disc thickness in various places, find significant variation and the diagnosis is cast in stone.

When disc brakes for high performance cars arrived on the scene we began to hear of "warped brake discs" on road going cars, with the same analyses and diagnoses. Typically, the discs are resurfaced to cure the problem and, equally typically, after a relatively short time the roughness or vibration comes back. Brake roughness has caused a significant number of cars to be bought back by their manufacturers under the "lemon laws". This has been going on for decades now - and, like most things that we have cast in stone, the diagnoses are wrong.

With one qualifier, presuming that the hub and wheel flange are flat and in good condition and that the wheel bolts or hat mounting hardware is in good condition, installed correctly and tightened uniformly and in the correct order to the recommended torque specification, in more than 40 years of professional racing, including the Shelby/Ford GT 40s – one of the most intense brake development program in history - I have never seen a warped brake disc. I have seen lots of cracked discs, (FIGURE 1) discs that had turned into shallow cones at operating temperature because they were mounted rigidly to their attachment bells or top hats, (FIGURE 2) a few where the friction surface had collapsed in the area between straight radial interior vanes, (FIGURE 3) and an untold number of discs with pad material unevenly deposited on the friction surfaces - sometimes visible and more often not. (FIGURE 4)

In fact every case of "warped brake disc" that I have investigated, whether on a racing car or a street car, has turned out to be friction pad material transferred unevenly to the surface of the disc. This uneven deposition results in thickness variation (TV) or run-out due to hot spotting that occurred at elevated temperatures.
 

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Speaking of Stoptech... has anyone tried their street brake pads? Wondering about changing the fronts with their 308 compound...
 

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You’ll get worse performance then stock, to be honest with you.

Those rotors are designed for show > over actual performance.

From StopTech’s site:

“WHY CROSS-DRILLED/SLOTTED ROTORS?
Drilled and Slotted brake rotors are designed to increase braking performance and are a perfect choice for vehicles with great looking wheels.

While we do not recommend drilled and slotted brake rotors for severe duty applications like racing, police, ambulance, or towing they do work excellent for street driven performance vehicles.”



LOL.

I can show you many other sites that sell regular blank rotors along side drilled and slotted one’s. Both drilled and slotted say: NOT FOR TRACK USE. While the regular blank rotors are good to go for track duty.

Drilled and slotted rotors remove precious metal from the rotor, leaving you with less MASS.

If you want true increased performance then you simply need to upgrade to a better brake pad that handles more heat and has more bite. The OEM blank rotor is best to handle all the heat you can throw at it and not CRACK under stress like a drilled rotor would. It’s all for show man. Don’t waste you money on that BS.
That thinking from 20 years ago is still being parroted across the internet today. Years ago drilled rotors were made by actually drilling sold rotors, which did create weaknesses in the castings that caused cracking between the holes. New technology has created new designs that are cast with the holes in place. These new rotors don't have the same propensity to crack, and in fact can perform better than solid rotors. They will heat faster, allowing you to use pads in a higher heat range, and will cool faster. I have a set of DBA drilled rotors on my MX-5. They work great and have done so for 3 years now with no issues.



Here is a pretty good discussion on this subject by some engineer types that actually tested and compared solid and drilled rotors-

https://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=580860&highlight=drilled+rotors

As to not good for the track, note post # 42 in that thread....

Not to hijack this thread, but what to do about the 'warping' that some of us experience with the OEM rear rotors?

Replace with another set of OEM rotors or upgrade to a different solid rotor, and which one?
They are throw aways, just replace them with something decent like Centric or StopTech.
Although I agree that today’s cast holes are better then previous drilled blank rotors, the fact remains that you still have a chance of cracking and you have less mass in the rotor from the removed material.

And what exactly am I looking at from the Miata link you provided and post #45 ?

Shows that the perforated rotor was constantly and considerably HOTTER then the blank. LOL.

If your goal is to quickly heat up race pads for maximum bite, and they can then handle the extra heat involved, then sure, do whatever floats your boat.

But for your average Joe, with a street vehicle, you don’t want GLOWING RED rotors while driving around town, burning off your brake pad material with a stench being left behind you.

What idiotic advice for a STREET DRIVEN car.
 

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Fact is, a drilled / slotted rotor provides some benefits but you then have to combat the loss of mass with higher temp pads to achieve the same result as stock.

You’ll get better performance then stock if you upgrade the pads to such an extent that even while glowing red, they will still provide more bite and an increase in performance... but at what cost? Increased brake dust? Increased brake noise? Reduced rotor life? Decreased brake pad life since the slotted rotor is constantly chopping away at the pad to “keep it clean”.

Shit gets pretty ridiculous after a certain point. Do I want to deal with all of that on a STREET CAR? HELL NO!!

I’ve done plenty of time attack racing with my 07 Civic Si back in the day using Hawk HP+ pads. I did my research and ended up using Brembo Blank rotors for durability and value because the pads were so aggressive that I was throwing the rotors away after a few track days because the pads were chewing thru them so quickly. Seeing the condition of the rotor face after a hardcore track day, I can’t imagine having a drilled or slotted rotor on there. No way it would have held up, and Stoptech advised me against it, and I listened with EXCELLENT RESULTS using Blank rotors.

Just trying to prove a point that I’m not spewing random info, I’m speaking from personal experience AT THE TRACK and then street driving said Civic Si with Hawk HPS pads and new Brembo Blanks for many many years.
 

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Post # 42 would be the one where the guy won the national championship at Road Atlanta with drilled rotors...reading comprehension is the beginning of understanding....

You don't need glowing rotors, just having the brake pads get up to operating temps faster is the key, or maybe you just don't realize what that means or what benefit it has....
There are some situations where you don't want drilled rotors and if you don't know when to use or not use them you should find out beforehand. Street use is just fine unless you are doing some real crazy stuff.

but at what cost? Increased brake dust? Increased brake noise? Reduced rotor life?
That is pad choice mostly, not rotor....The rotors make a slight whoosing noise thats not an issue at all unless you are real OCD...

Decreased brake pad life since the slotted rotor is constantly chopping away at the pad to “keep it clean”
Total misrepresentation and misunderstanding of how they work. Read the linked post for explanations.
They don't "chop away at the pad"....:bash::bash:

I find that the perforated rotors work better, even for a street car. Use the the right pads and there won't be any issues unless you are doing something stupid, in which case it doesn't really matter either way.
 

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I like my OEM brakes/calipers/pads. The stuff works in all situations on these cars...
CK
I get free brake pad replacement at the dealer too. Big bonus.
 

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Post # 42 would be the one where the guy won the national championship at Road Atlanta with drilled rotors...reading comprehension is the beginning of understanding....

You don't need glowing rotors, just having the brake pads get up to operating temps faster is the key, or maybe you just don't realize what that means or what benefit it has....
There are some situations where you don't want drilled rotors and if you don't know when to use or not use them you should find out beforehand. Street use is just fine unless you are doing some real crazy stuff.
Lol. Ok so his brake pads got up to temp with the first brake application, at the very first turn while the rest of the competition got up to temp at the second turn, and after that, all brakes were running around the track with the brakes HOT and at operating temps. Lol.

At that point race cars need brake COOLING as not to overheat the brakes and go beyond the brake pad operating temp. So if you’ve got rotors that are causing +200F temp increase... that’s just more heat to try to dissipate after each turn.

Unless he’s got pads that are struggling to maintain OT and bite and he needs that extra 200F, sure, by all means.

I certainly wouldn’t want brakes that get up to 300F during normal use vs another setup that runs at 120F. LOL. Constantly frying the hubs, bearings, rims, giving of excess heat to the tires, = less life on all the components around the brakes. Shit does Not. Make. Sense on a street car.

I evaluate all the variables and make an educated decision based on the ultimate goal. For be, that’s durability for all the components. I don’t want to waste my time and money replacing the wheel bearing in 50,000 miles because I was a dumb ass and choose to run a brake setup that was constantly running EXTRA HOT redlight to redlight. But you go ahead and enjoy it. Sounds like a good way to spend the weekend. I’ll be out driving my car.
 

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but at what cost? Increased brake dust? Increased brake noise? Reduced rotor life?
That is pad choice mostly, not rotor....The rotors make a slight whoosing noise thats not an issue at all unless you are real OCD...

Decreased brake pad life since the slotted rotor is constantly chopping away at the pad to “keep it clean”
Total misrepresentation and misunderstanding of how they work. Read the linked post for explanations.
They don't "chop away at the pad"....


I find that the perforated rotors work better, even for a street car. Use the the right pads and there won't be any issues unless you are doing something stupid, in which case it doesn't really matter either way.
Bro, I know the short term benefit from slotted / drilled rotors. I understand their intent to help remove dust & debris, give a place for gases to go, blah blah blah.

Fact is, they will wear faster, they will wear the pads down faster and since they can’t be resurfaced, you’ll need to replace the rotors when you replace the pads. Ah yes, extra money down the drain... fun fun fun.

But hey, the shit looks cool at cars and coffee, so I guess it’s worth it.
 

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Believe what you want, you are parroting stuff that was being spouted 20 years ago when these things were actually crap. Its the 21st century now, many things have changed. Your total lack of understanding of how this works is non-productive....they don't wear faster, the holes are not there to "give the gases a place to go blah blah blah"....thats pretty funny actually...:laughing001::laughing001: I have 3 years nearly and thousands of miles on my rotors, the rotors and pads are hardly worn.

Lol. Ok so his brake pads got up to temp with the first brake application, at the very first turn while the rest of the competition got up to temp at the second turn, and after that, all brakes were running around the track with the brakes HOT and at operating temps. Lol.

At that point race cars need brake COOLING as not to overheat the brakes and go beyond the brake pad operating temp. So if you’ve got rotors that are causing +200F temp increase... that’s just more heat to try to dissipate after each turn.
The point here is the pads get heated faster then cool faster, they don't stay hot unless you need them. They don't get hotter than others, they just heat faster....again, comprehension is the key to understanding....better brakes = braking deeper = faster car.....its not hard to understand.

I certainly wouldn’t want brakes that get up to 300F during normal use vs another setup that runs at 120F. LOL. Constantly frying the hubs, bearings, rims, giving of excess heat to the tires, = less life on all the components around the brakes
I would not want brakes that never got over 300°F, they would hardly work. One good stab at speed and it should be well over that.....Most cars can get way over 300° going down a long grade, two or three times that sometimes. If a car can't handle those temps without parts failing there is a serious problem somewhere.:bash::bash:
 

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Believe what you want, you are parroting stuff that was being spouted 20 years ago when these things were actually crap. Its the 21st century now, many things have changed. Your total lack of understanding of how this works is non-productive....they don't wear faster, the holes are not there to "give the gases a place to go blah blah blah"....thats pretty funny actually...<img src="http://mazda3revolution.com/forums/images/smilies/laughing001.gif" border="0" alt="" title="laughing001" class="inlineimg" /><img src="http://mazda3revolution.com/forums/images/smilies/laughing001.gif" border="0" alt="" title="laughing001" class="inlineimg" /> I have 3 years nearly and thousands of miles on my rotors, the rotors and pads are hardly worn.
Da hell are you getting your info from?

Quote from Brembo’s site:

“Cross-drilled and slotted finishes are designed and executed with meticulous precision. These holes or slots in the braking surface help dissipate heat and eliminate brake dust and gases.
Every Brembo product is designed in relation to the specific performance requisites.”

And another quote from Brembo:

“The unique cross-drilled or slotted finish is another exclusive Brembo feature which improves braking consistency by dissipating the heat generated and gas released as the pads come into contact with the discs, keeping the pad surface both cool and clean.”

So what did I say wrong? Where’s my understanding flawed? Do teach me oh mighty one.

Oh and, the fact that you have 3 years and thousands of miles on your brakes and they’re hardly worn = you drive like a pussy, granny style, and barely build any heat in your brakes.

Nice driving grandpa. Keep it up. These brakes are probably the last set you’ll ever need.
 

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I certainly wouldn’t want brakes that get up to 300F during normal use vs another setup that runs at 120F. LOL. Constantly frying the hubs, bearings, rims, giving of excess heat to the tires, = less life on all the components around the brakes
I would not want brakes that never got over 300°F, they would hardly work. One good stab at speed and it should be well over that.....Most cars can get way over 300° going down a long grade, two or three times that sometimes. If a car can't handle those temps without parts failing there is a serious problem somewhere.
I used the 300F brake temp from post 45 that you provided as a reference. I know brakes get hotter then that.

I’m tired of comparing dick sizes with you.

You don’t understand the simple fact that big brake kits offer drilled / slotted or both for their benefits but then increase the rotor size in order to compensate for the mass lost from the drilled / slotted material removal so that you still have MASS in the rotors to contain heat.

Then the combination of all the cooling effects + a big rotor which is close to an OEM blank = improved brakes vs stock. This shit is not rocket science.
 

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Guys, I really like your conversation, but can you give me feedback on Stoptech Street pads? They are hard to find in Europe, but considering the limited choice for Gen3, I'm thinking of changing the front OE pads with Stoptech's pads.
 
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